The State of Black Tie: Your Observations

[Blog Marley]

I'm building out my black tie collection: black and midnight tuxedos plus a dinner jacket and would appreciate some help on the last few pieces. I appreciate the help.

For shoes I'm thinking of a pair of patent opera pumps and a pair of plain black toe Oxfords. For the shoes I'm in between cordovan Aldens and C&J's Wembely. It seems like cordovan is doable but not a popular choice. My preference is to keep the shoes under $900. I'd prefer to try on in person, I'm in NYC.

For ties I have a midnight navy tie and was going to pick up a black one. Do I need another? It seems like the forum frowns upon pre-tied ties but for some reason I like the look of Tom Ford's velvet ties I guess it falls into the wear what you like category but I'm curious about the rules and traditions here.

For braces it sounds like Albert Thurston is the beginning and end for braces? I'm leaning towards black here.

 

[hpreston]

I’ve got a couple questions.

How many events per year are you wearing black tie?

You’re putting together a midnight rig and black rig, plus a separate dinner jacket to mix and match? So three jackets, two trousers?

For shoes, a pump and an oxford should cover you. If you’re adding another shoe maybe a Belgian loafer in black suede or black velvet.

For ties, above a black and a midnight, you don’t really need another (again, how many events a year?). But if you did get another, black velvet sounds good (tie your self, not pre tied)

Braces, yes, black…. Thurston is the way to go.

 

[MattyS]

Sounds weird but I have had grosgrain silk where the braids have been cut from the same silks.

Alternatively, you can buy grosgrain braids or OFB (my preference) from the lining company.

I have several pairs of trousers with a grosgrain stripe down the outside of the trouser leg. None of them have any issues, as far as I can tell. There is nothing visibly wrong, which equates to nothing wrong, in my mind.

Find a different tailor.

The tailor who made my tuxedo had similar concerns and, additionally, wasn’t sure if the ribbing should be horizontal or diagonal. In spite of their recommendation to not use grosgrain, I asked them to do their best and it worked out just fine. No issues that I can see.

Thanks to all three of you. I asked the tailor for some more details, and they said that their concern has to do with the thickness of the grosgrain that's available to them. They suggested that it's thicker than normal, which is why they don't recommended it for trousers or cummerbunds.

I'm in the UAE, where there are not as many tailoring or fabric options as elsewhere. This is certainly one of the best tailors -- perhaps the best -- in the country. They have made a number of beautiful and perfectly fitting suits and jackets and suits for me. So, I suspect that they have at least some idea of what they're talking about. I'm tempted to ask them try the grosgrain and see what happens.

Last question. When you do opt for grosgrain, what direction do the stripes run: horizontally, vertically, or diagonally?

 

[The Chai]

Horizantally but I prefer OFB braid with grosgrain lapels over grosgrain stripes for the trousers. The only time I match the stripe to the lapel is if I have it faced with satin.

 

[Blog Marley]

Thank you! Answers inline.

I’ve got a couple questions.

How many events per year are you wearing black tie?

2-4 now but could increase in the future.

You’re putting together a midnight rig and black rig, plus a separate dinner jacket to mix and match? So three jackets, two trousers?

Correct

For shoes, a pump and an oxford should cover you. If you’re adding another shoe maybe a Belgian loafer in black suede or black velvet.

For ties, above a black and a midnight, you don’t really need another (again, how many events a year?). But if you did get another, black velvet sounds good (tie your self, not pre tied)

I'll probably stick with the black and midnight navy for now. If the number of events increases I'll look for a black velvet. I haven't found many self-tying options during a quick search.

Braces, yes, black…. Thurston is the way to go.

 

[MattyS]

Horizantally but I prefer OFB braid with grosgrain lapels over grosgrain stripes for the trousers. The only time I match the stripe to the lapel is if I have it faced with satin.

Could you please explain what OFB braid is? I'm not familiar with the term.

 

[The Chai]

Could you please explain what OFB braid is? I'm not familiar with the term.

OFB Pattern Braid 16mm Black - The Lining Company

 

[MattyS]

OFB Pattern Braid 16mm Black - The Lining Company

Nice. Thanks!

 

[classicalthunde]

I'm building out my black tie collection: black and midnight tuxedos plus a dinner jacket and would appreciate some help on the last few pieces. I appreciate the help.

IMHO, I think a black tuxedo and midnight tuxedo both tick off the same formal box and are a bit too similar to need both versions.

If I had 2-4 black tie events a year to go to (assuming throughout the year), I'd do the following:

a DB shawl ivory DJ (self facing)
a SB shawl bottle green velvet DJ (self facing)
black trousers
a 3-piece SB peak midnight tuxedo
midnight cumberbund
black cumberbund

this would tick off hot weather, cold weather, formal and informal. The vest and cumberbund would allow you to add some versatility to your formal tuxedo rig.

 

[hpreston]

Could you please explain what OFB braid is? I'm not familiar with the term.

OFB Pattern Braid 16mm Black - The Lining Company

Nice. Thanks!

I think OFB stands for Old Fashioned Braid. ( as shown in link ) As opposed to using the more modern silk facings that match the lapel facings.

 

[The Chai]

Throw in a single breasted shawl in midnight mohair and that's the bare minimum for me these days 🤣

 

[The Chai]

Throw in a single breasted shawl in midnight mohair and that's the bare minimum for me these days 🤣

 

[Mark from Plano]

IMHO, I think a black tuxedo and midnight tuxedo both tick off the same formal box and are a bit too similar to need both versions.

If I had 2-4 black tie events a year to go to (assuming throughout the year), I'd do the following:

a DB shawl ivory DJ (self facing)
a SB shawl bottle green velvet DJ (self facing)
black trousers
a 3-piece SB peak midnight tuxedo
midnight cumberbund
black cumberbund

this would tick off hot weather, cold weather, formal and informal. The vest and cumberbund would allow you to add some versatility to your formal tuxedo rig.

My own setup is very similar to this:

a SB peak ivory DJ (self facing)
a SB shawl Black Watch DJ (silk facing and turn back cuffs)
black trousers
a 3-piece SB peak midnight tuxedo
Patterned cumberbund
black cumberbund

 

[ericgereghty]

I have no idea how bottle green velvet caught on as such a "must have" piece of formalwear. I hate it.

Entirely subjective, of course, but it isn't remotely for me.

 

[hpreston]

IMHO, I think a black tuxedo and midnight tuxedo both tick off the same formal box and are a bit too similar to need both versions.

If I had 2-4 black tie events a year to go to (assuming throughout the year), I'd do the following:

a DB shawl ivory DJ (self facing)
a SB shawl bottle green velvet DJ (self facing)
black trousers
a 3-piece SB peak midnight tuxedo
midnight cumberbund
black cumberbund

this would tick off hot weather, cold weather, formal and informal. The vest and cumberbund would allow you to add some versatility to your formal tuxedo rig.

My own setup is very similar to this:

a SB peak ivory DJ (self facing)
a SB shawl Black Watch DJ (silk facing and turn back cuffs)
black trousers
a 3-piece SB peak midnight tuxedo
Patterned cumberbund
black cumberbund

I have no idea how bottle green velvet caught on as such a "must have" piece of formalwear. I hate it.

Entirely subjective, of course, but it isn't remotely for me.

I am with you on the green velvet. If I had the need (multiple events during the year) and was adding to existing black tie wear (Midnight DB shawl two piece, and separate Ivory SB shawl odd dinner jacket) I'd likely add a blackwatch or similar odd dinner jacket vice a green velvet (maybe I'd do black velvet??)